April 26 is Lesbian Visibility Day. In its honor, we’re posting an article about the experiences of ace and aro people who identify as lesbians. This includes bi, pan, and other mspec lesbians, they/them and he/him lesbians, non-binary and trans lesbians, sapphics, and anyone else who feels connected to the lesbian identity. Thank you so much to all our contributors!
Introductions
A – I am an oriented aroace lesbian! I am asexual and quiromantic.
Alex – I identity with the lesbian label, as I’m not attracted to men, and am for the most part not a man myself! I think I may still fit under the bi umbrella as I am still attracted to more than one gender, but personally I feel comfortable under both the lesbian and bi label!
I’m asexual! It took me a while to realize that, I didn’t realise that asexual still left room for romantic attraction, if I knew I’m sure I’d have been prouder to identify as it sooner!
Amaranthe Rae – polyromantic, gray-asexual, lesbian, sapphic
Dru – Polygender Lesbian. Arospec questioning and asexual.
Jamiffer – So I’m trans, demisexual, and for sure a non-binary woman. When I do experience attraction, which is in general not common and in general comes from the way I feel about a person’s spirit/soul rather than their physical form.
Jane – I’m an aroacespec bi-lesbian
Lucia – Asexual, aro-spec, nonbinary lesbian
Marie – I identify as an aroacelesbian
Mel – I am sapphic-leaning panromantic, in a lesbian marriage, and am grayasexual/asexual.
Orli – I identify as aromantic and lesbian (so, my romantic identity is aromantic and my sexual identity is lesbian), as well as lovequeer.
Rain Ashley – I am a trans woman, lesbian and demiromantic asexual
Sofia – I’m an asexual lesbian. (Lesbian being my romantic orientation. You could also say I’m homoromantic, I guess)
Tamara – I identify as a homoromantic, asexual woman
Tefa – I specifically identify as fraysexual, but I usually go for the more generic asexual if I’m not among people that would know the microlabel. I am also a latinoamerican woman living in Europe, so being an immigrant woman is also an important part of my identity which intersects with my sexuality. I identify as a biromantic lesbian.
Y – I’m an alloaro (non-ace aro) lesbian.
Questions
How do you feel connected to/define the lesbian label or community?
A: I experience aesthetic and alterous attraction to women. To me I feel like I could be in a fulfilling relationship with a woman one day. I think I am generally connected to my lesbian identity because of how much I love and simp for women😅 of course in my non-romantic and non-sexual way.
Alex: I always considered myself bisexual, because I wasn’t just attracted to women. But wasn’t ever really attracted to men. Then my partner (NB) approached me about them possible being a lesbian, witch at first confused me, because I’d only ever heard it refered to as wlw, when in reality it’s for non men attracted to non men! (Which I think fits me well!)
AR: I define “lesbian” as “someone who experiences queer attraction to women.” I had my first romantic crush when I was 19, and it didn’t take me long after that to start identifying as lesbian. (Yes, 19. Really. My first crush was on a college friend. I’m not entirely sure whether or not I was repressed when I was younger or I literally had never encountered anyone I considered crush-worthy before. Considering where I grew up, I feel like both options are feasible.) I feel far more connected to the lesbian label than I do to the community; as an aspec lesbian, some of the most virulent acemisia I have received has been from cis zedsexual lesbians. That has made me less than enthused about trying to join lesbian communities.
Dru: I see the lesbian community as a community bound strongly by its shared love for women and a desire to be liberated from the patriarchy and cisheteronormative hegemony. I define lesbian as anyone who feels a queer love for women or other sapphic individuals and feels a connection to the lesbian label.
Jamiffer: My identity with the lesbian community was hard for me to process for a variety of reasons, most of which are transphobic. To be quite fair, I’ve never seen IRL lesbians who aren’t accepting… the lesbian community has created a huge subset of GNC presentations and my experience with their IRL communities has been that “Trans woman” (even those who aren’t passing) are, ya know, women. And therefore welcome in the community. But, and this is a side-note of TERFism, as a trans woman I live in a world that constantly tries to call me a man, which creates a sort of imposter syndrome. Nevertheless, consistently throughout my life, even before I came out, the closest people in my life have been or were at one time members of lesbian communities. Whenever I watch movies or read books by lesbians for lesbians, I find myself in them. When lesbians share memes, I laugh. And when I first tried on the label for myself it felt like snuggling under a blanket in front of a small, dying fire as snow falls outside. I feel like I’m just connected? IDK. It feels like whenever I find the people most like myself they are either trans people or lesbians (and very frequently, both). And I don’t know that I can define it either… I guess in a way it’s like Justice Potter Stewart’s definition of pornography: “I know it when I see it.” It’s a set of ways that people from marginalized genders interact with each other… a sort of shared culture that often persists across other typical community divides.
Lucia: Although many people think lesbian only means women who love women, lesbianism is actually a broad spectrum that can mean different things to each individual based on their own unique experiences. I am a non-man who loves non-men and I proudly call myself a nonbinary lesbian.
Marie: I dont feel connected to the lesbian community since it is very sexualized and relationship focused. But thats honestly because the world is so sex and love focused.
Mel: I am sapphic within romance and in a lesbian marriage. I like the word sapphic because it feels like it does not carry any restrictions to attraction and relationships, whereas “lesbian” often feels like it comes with baggage.
Orli: I define ‘lesbian’ as “a woman or someone woman-aligned who primarily feels attraction to other women and women-aligned people,” aka someone who identifies with the “girl” label, even partly, (for example a demigirl) who mostly likes other girls. I don’t mind if someone who doesn’t strictly fit that identifies as lesbian though, it’s their life, not mine.
RA: I had to realize that I was a trans woman before I can figure out that I can even be a lesbian, so I was shocked to find out that an AMAB like me can be a lesbian, and I am loving it.
Sofia: I’m a girl who has some sort of attraction to girls. I’m not interested in men romantically or sexually. That’s all it is for me.
Tamara: I define the lesbian label as women being attracted to other women. I feel connected to the label through my romantic attraction to other women.
Tefa: To me being a lesbian is about having attraction and wanting to have relationships with women, no matter if those relationships are sexual, romantic or platonic.
How does being a lesbian or lesbian aligned person intersect with being aspec for you?
A: I think because I questioned the foundations romance and sex for a really long time due to my aspec identities- I think my love for women manifests very, abundantly? Sorry if I am being vague, but my love to women is really just, limitless. Mostly because I have learned to not define love in simple labels and such, and to just love in my own ways-whatever those ways may be.
Alex: I’m asexual, I still feel romantically towards others, but I’ve personally never experienced sexual attraction to anyone! Only romantic!
AR: I am romantically attracted to women, and have experienced sexual attraction to one woman. So when I call myself “lesbian” I am referring to both my romantic and sexual attraction. However, I’m one of those varioriented (in my case, polyromantic gray-A) people who can easily tell the difference between their romantic and sexual orientations. My romantic attraction to women is totally separate from my sexual attraction to women (er, woman). Even if we’re just talking about my attraction to my wife, I can tell the difference between feeling romantic and sexual attraction to her. So my lesbian identity has always felt very separate from my aspec identity, even though they are both part of me.
Dru: It’s pretty esoteric and hard to explain, but the expectation to grow up, get married, and have children that society often projects on people is something that I have no desire or ability to fulfill which, for me at least, is in part influenced by both my own lesbian and asexual identities. My personal lack of certain types of attraction overlap in this way. And of course I acknowledge that these identities don’t inherently hinder one’s want or ability to do these things, but this is how they affect me as an individual.
Jamiffer: I don’t have a lot of sex lol.
Marie: The intersection with being aspec is because even though I’m aro ace, i want to be in a committed relationship with a woman and I experience aesthetic attraction to them.
Mel: It means a complete abandonment of the cishet expectations I previously associated with relationships. These identities transformed my idea of what sex can be and how to approach it.
Orli: Mostly in that I only feel sexual attraction to girls, but I don’t feel romantic attraction to anyone
RA: I am more of a platonic lesbian than anything.
Sofia: It often leads to me questioning whether I’m really a lesbian, since I’m not sexually attracted to girls. It also feels like my two identities have trouble coexisting at times.
Tamara: For me personally, it is a straightforward divide between my romantic attraction to women and lack of sexual attraction to everyone.
Tefa: There are a lot of stereotypes about female friendship and patriarchal society tends to invalidate w/w relationships if they don’t have sex. We are not “just friends” just because we don’t have intercourse.
Y: It’s interesting, for me these two parts of myself pretty much go together. I couldn’t really talk about my aromanticism without mentioning my lesbian identity, or vice versa. They have a synergistic relationship.
How is your experience in aspec communities impacted by being a lesbian or lesbian-aligned?
AR: Honestly, my involvement with aspec communities had been very limited in recent years because I re-closeted myself for a time in my 20’s (for reference, I am 31) due to acemisia, and I have only recently been re-engaging with aspec community. When I was more active in the aspec community 10+ years ago, I mostly felt welcome as someone who identified as lesbian in addition to aspec. There were occasional incidents of lesbomisia, sure, but I didn’t feel like those incidents were any more common than in any other community; if anything, I have experienced less lesbomisia in aspec communities than in general.
Lucia: In the past, I have faced some hostility and invalidation as an oriented arospec. It’s not super frequent and often it’s people who don’t understand that aromanticism is a spectrum and you can still be oriented as an arospec person.
Mel: Being lesbian-aligned in aspec communities feels like acceptance, because aspec communities tend to understand that everything is a spectrum and exploring where you fall on those spectrums is part of the fun.
Orli: There’s a LOT of focus in the general aspec community on being aroace and thinking sex is gross, which can feel alienating to someone like me, who DOES like sex. Other than that, though, the aspec community has been very welcoming and kind.
RA: Being asexual has made accepting my other queer identities a whole lot easier, because being asexual means that either way I could never be straight.
Sofia: Honestly, aspec people are usually very accepting and fully embrace my lesbian identity, but it can still feel awkward discussing my attraction to girls in aspec circles, because the community tends to focus on lack of (or diminished) attraction in general.
Tamara: I don’t think there is much of an impact on my experience, since many asexual people experience romantic attraction, no matter the preferred gender.
How is your experience with other lesbians or in lesbian communities impacted by being aspec?
Alex: It’s only really awkward on occasions, when I introduce myself by the label but then say I’m asexual, I think its just because there’s still a misconception that asexuality is exactly the same as being aroace
AR: As I’ve mentioned before, some of the most virulent acemisia I have received has been from cis zedsexual lesbians. I don’t just mean 10+ years ago on LiveJournal when I first heard the line “asexuals don’t get to be queer because you didn’t have a Stonewall” from a white cis zedsexual lesbian (I note that she was white and cis because I feel like it’s important to point out she didn’t have a Stonewall either). That “Stonewall” bit was a popular line that I heard for years, and it was hurtful as it was baffling. Even as recently as last year, I left a lesbian online community when I outed myself as asexual and was met with an onslaught of people telling me they “hope[d] I [wasn’t] homophobic” or outright accusing me of “homophobia” for my choice of label. I don’t feel safe in lesbian communities.
Jamiffer: Sometimes I feel a little left out or broken when lesbians talk about how “hot” someone is. IDK I don’t really get attracted to bodies so much as people. So like, is Amelia Eve hot? Maybe. Is Jamie from Bly Manor hot? Friend, I must inform you that I am *GAY*. Aromanticism is… its own weird little challenge. I’m still trying to figure that one out.
Jane: There isn’t a place for aspec voices in the lesbian community, I’m seen as “less lesbian”. And I don’t read or watch lesbian representation because I’m romance repulsed and lesbians are usually represented in a romantic context or a sexual one.
Lucia: My experience with the lesbian community and other lesbians has generally been pretty positive. I received support and comfort and got a chance to talk to other aspec lesbians. I’ve only had a few negative interactions and most of them were people saying untrue things online.
Orli: I’m not very connected with the lesbian community, but from what I’ve seen, there seems to be a lot of “shared experience” type posts and things about, for example, having a (very explicitly romantic) crush on a straight girl, or going very fast in a romantic relationship, and there’s usually this undertone of “if you don’t have this experience, are you REALLY lesbian?”, which can feel very isolating. But that’s just what I’ve seen in my very limited exploration into my lesbian identity, so it doesn’t necessarily describe all of it.
RA: On the most part my fellow lesbians has been very accepting of me being a trans woman lesbian asexual, but I did come across some lesbians that could only see me as a man and therefore can’t be a lesbian.
Sofia: Lesbian (and queer in general) communities tend to place a lot of value on sex. It can be very alienating at times, and I don’t always feel like I belong in lesbian communities.
Tamara: While I’ve mostly had positive reactions when coming out as ace in lesbian spaces, I’ve also experienced disbelief and confusion about how it can be possible to be ace and lesbian at the same time. While these reactions mostly come from a place of ignorance it can be hurtful to have your identity questioned like that.
Tefa: It has been hard to fit in lesbian communities, because I have often encountered that they are very sex-centric. I felt isolated for not being able to discuss sex the way other lesbians do.
Y: Most, if not all sapphic communities I’ve crossed paths with so far are very much focused on romance and getting into romantic relationships, and as a result very alloro-centric. It can be hard to find a safe space, especially as an arospec lesbian.
Upon realizing that you were aspec, did you question or change your lesbian orientation?
Alex: I knew I was asexual before I even considered I may be a lesbian! So I didn’t feel the need to change anything at the time!
AR: I knew I was aspec when I was as young as 10. I didn’t realize I was a lesbian until I was 19, so when I realized I was aspec, I didn’t know to question my lesbian orientation. So, no.
Jamiffer: Lesbian came after aspec, actually. So, no.
Jane: When I realized I was aroace I didn’t knew I could also be oriented so I denied my other attractions. I wasn’t feeling valid at all into calling myself bi or lesbian because I felt like an impostor. Now I know I’m an aroace bi-lesbian and I’m proud of it!
Lucia: At first, I wasn’t sure if I was still allowed to call myself a lesbian because I was both on the aromantic spectrum and asexual. After a lot of research and discussing with other aroace spec lesbians, I realized that my identity is valid and that both aroace and lesbian describe my experiences as a queer person.
Marie: I honestly identified as nothing at first just knowing that I was queer and then it was aroace. After some soul searching I noticed that aroace lesbian is the most accurate orientation.
Mel: My aspec realization came before my lesbian orientation, though it did make my lesbian realization easier to contextualize later. Knowing I was asexual/greyace made the sapphic romantic attraction easier to process.
RA: It did not, because I realized that I was asexual first.
Sofia: I actually found out I was asexual before finding out I was a lesbian! But yeah, my aspec-ness had a huge impact on figuring out that I was a lesbian.
Tamara: I realized my romantic attraction to women years before I learned about asexuality. When I did, it was like a missing piece clicking into place. I’ve never questioned my identity after that.
Tefa: Realizing I was aspec allowed me to understand why I felt like I was not fitting in with other lesbians. I could then understand the lesbian label in a more broad way where I could feel comfortable.
Y: I did question it, for sure. I’ve always been sure about being aro, but I didn’t know how that could work out with my attraction to women. I didn’t really have anything to compare my experiences to, so I doubted it for a long time.
How could aspec communities better support you?
Alex: I feel very safe in that community (a bit more than I do in the lesbian one personally)
AR: I’ve generally had positive experiences as a lesbian aspec person in aspec communities, but I also feel like I’ve partly been lucky and partly been wise about my choice of aspec communities to join. So I can’t really brainstorm any suggestions for how aspec communities could better support aspec lesbians. That said, there is lesbomisia in every community, and it would be foolish to pretend that aspec communities were any different.
Marie: Aspec communities could be more aware that adding a gay/pan/bi label to aroace means that we tend to want companionship or experience a type of attraction to certain genders.
Orli: Probably by placing less of an emphasis on the “ace” part of “aro and ace spectrums”, and being a lot more inclusive of aroallos (and by not putting specifically ace things in aro tags! Why do people still do this??)
RA: Not me specifically, but before I realized that I was a trans girl lesbian I just assumed that I was heteroromantic, and because of that I questioned whether I was queer enough or straight enough. I also had people tell me that as heteroromantic that I had no right to use the word queer. We need to let people know that hetero aces are still queer.
Tefa: I wish aspec communities were more supportive of minorities that are hypersexualized by society, especially woc and w/w relationships.
What do you wish aspec people knew about you or other aspec lesbians or lesbian aligned people?
Alex: Some aspec people don’t considered you can have two sexualities, when in fact you can, I’m asexual 1, but I’m also attracted to nonmen (lesbian) 2!
AR: I honestly can’t think of anything. Maybe if I had been more active in aspec communities recently, I would have something useful to say, but sadly, I don’t.
Marie: I’m not that involved in the aspec community other than seeing some tumblr posts from people I follow but I really love the acceptance and the validation of your feelings. It’s how I discovered that I’m aroace.
Mel: I wish aspec people knew that being aspec does not erase the discrimination faced when in a lesbian marriage. We still have to “come out” continually, regardless of the aspects of my identity that won’t be displayed as publicly.
RA: It is up to the individual to define what being a lesbian or asexual can be, no two are exactly the same.
What do you wish allo people knew about you or other aspec lesbians or lesbian aligned people?
A: I just want them to know that the aromantic and asexual identities are, indeed, a very wide spectrum, and to not view our identities as simply black and white. There is surprisingly a lot of nuance when it comes to our labels and the ways we define ourselves. also our other forms of attraction are very well valid and not “inferior” to romantic/sexual attraction.
Alex: We exist! And we’re not going anywhere, regardless of whether or not they think the stereotypes of lesbians and aspec fit together!
AR: I wish they knew that being a lesbian isn’t all about lesbian sex or being sexually attracted to other women. My romantic attraction to women makes me as much of a lesbian as my sexual attraction to my wife. Also, my gray-asexuality does not modify or dilute my lesbianism. I’m not 50% lesbian, 50% gray-asexual; I’m 100% lesbian and 100% gray-asexual.
Jamiffer: Being aspec does not necessarily mean that we won’t fuck. Some aspec people are very sex-positive and would love to do the things that you love to do because you love to do them. So, ya know, be communicative about your desires, but I think we’ve heard that one before
Jane: People are in a binary around romance/sex, and being aroace oriented always is something people deny and struggle to understand, because it’s revolutionary. My other attractions are enough to name them, even if they’re not romantic and sexual.
Lucia: I wish allo people knew that not every aspec lesbian is the same. It truly is a huge spectrum and each person’s experience will be different and unique. For example, some aspec lesbians are part of the aromantic spectrum, but that doesn’t necessarily mean they’re ace, and vice versa.
Marie: I wish allo and lesbian people knew that being aroace and wanting a qpp relationship is not just being friends. QPP relationships/or other labels have more of a commitment than just being friends.
Mel: I wish that allo people knew that aspec lesbian relationships are not platonic relationships or “just friends.” I wish that allo people understood that asexuality does not mean a lack of sex, and that being asexual does not negate my other sexual identities.
Orli: That aromantic lesbians exist, and we’re not confused or just “waiting for that special someone” to turn us allo.
RA: Being a lesbian doesn’t require you to have sexual acttraction, any attraction to girls from girls only will do.
Sofia: I would like them to stop dismissing my asexual identity. Yes, I’m a lesbian, and yes, it’s an important part of who I am, but you can’t erase my asexuality because I’m romantically attracted to girls!
Tamara: I wish that allo people were a bit more aware that different types of attraction exist, and that sexual and romantic attraction are not necessarily the same for everyone.
Tefa: I wish allo people would understand that our relationships are not less queer or less meaningful just because we don’t have sex.
What do you wish other lesbians knew about you or other aspec lesbians or lesbian aligned people?
A: That just because we are aspec, doesn’t mean we will love you any less than allo folks. If we express that we like you, you can trust that we definitely want to form a relationship with you. Also it’s always crucial to communicate! Relationships, especially amongst allo and aspec folks, should and will contain nuance! And lots of other confusing moments! don’t be afraid to voice any concerns you may have- just remember to not invalidate the aspec and/or lesbian identity of your partner!
Alex: We’re still lesbians! Whether or not we’re exactly like them!
AR: Well, I’m repeating myself somewhat, but I wish zedsexual lesbians specifically understood that aspec lesbians are not lesser or diluted or modified lesbians. We’re lesbians, and we’re also aspec. Live with it. Also, asexuality is inherently fucking queer. Aspec lesbians aren’t queer only because we’re lesbians; both our aspec and lesbian identities are queer.
Jane: I face a lot of aphobia in the lesbian community, so I can’t explore this part of me. So I wish them to know that it’s not up to me to adapt myself to them, it’s the lesbian community that should include EVERY lesbian and every lesbian experiences. Being lesbian isn’t only defined by romance and sex, I’m lesbian in far more many ways.
Mel: I wish that other lesbians knew that my lack of certain sexual experiences does not negate my identity within the lesbian community. There is no right way to be a lesbian, and complexity of labeling does not mean confusion or lack of experience.
Orli: That we can like girls sexually, while also not liking them romantically, and that it hurts when they imply that romantic love is the baseline or the only real way to be lesbian.
RA: Being an asexual doesn’t make us any less of a lesbian or nor does being a lesbian doesn’t make us any less of an asexual
Sofia: I just wish that they were more aware that there can be so much more to lesbian relationships than sex!
Tamara: I wish that other lesbians knew that aspec identities in lesbian spaces are just as valid and that our experiences overlap in many aspects. There is no need to be weirded out or shocked that it’s possible to experience same-sex attraction, even when on the aro-ace spectrum.
Tefa: I wish other lesbians understood that just because I don’t experience sexual attraction to women that doesn’t make me less of a lesbian. I wish they were more open to other types of w/w relationships.
Y: Romance isn’t the hallmark of being a lesbian. Some of us out there don’t yearn for romance, some of us don’t even want to get into a relationship, and that’s okay. I think acknowledging that there’s a vast amount of experiences among us first and foremost would make a lot of us feel much more included.